Loading the 8x60R Kropatschek
Loading the 8x60R Kropatschek
When we hear the word “Kropatschek” most people think about the 1886 Portuguese version, although other countries used it. While there were three major users (Portugal, Austria-Hungary and France, a number of other countries used various versions. There were several other models starting with the M1878 and finishing with the M1886/91 carbine, all of which are uncommon.
Steyr M1886 Kropatschek (top) and Mauser M1871/84 (bottom)
Like the Mauser Gewehr 1871/84, it uses an under barrel tubular magazine and while it started out as a blackpowder 11 mm rifle it made the transition to 8 mm and smokeless powder. It also lent features to the French M1886 Lebel rifle. In spite of this, it should be treated as a late blackpowder rifle and not a modern 8mm like the M98 Mauser or even a M91 Mauser.
(left to right) Comparable cartridges of the period: 11mm Mauser, 8x60R Krop,
8x58R Danish, 8x52R Thai, 303 British
The rifle used for this testing shows a receiver date of 1886 and was made by Steyr. As was typical for the period, the rifle was long (52” overall), with a 32” barrel and weighing 10 lbs 3 oz. Finding a Kropatschek in good shooting condition is easy because ammo has never been available for them. Which means that since they could not be shot, hence the demand and prices are low.
Making the brass is possible but the starting point noted by Donnelly is the 450 NE, with the rim being turned and considerable sizing to get the finished case. Another option is to use 348 Winchester brass and while not ideal, it is functional – this is discussed in the Handloader article referenced in the resources section. Dimensions such as the shorter length does not really impact anything, however the slightly smaller rim may mean that some guns will not eject it as well.
The Krop case is similar to the 43 Mauser in that the rim is stepped and not flat like most cases. In the next photo one can see how the bolt head is concave to accept the “A” type rim. In high pressure cartridges, this difference in rim thickness, which is what headspace is based on, would have been a serious issue. Provided that care is taken to limit pressures and to NOT set the shoulder back during sizing, the case can headspace on the shoulder instead of the rim.
The beveled bolt face is meant to be mated with the “A” style case head, not the more
common flat case head
The next photo shows how even with a low pressure load, the primer has backed out (around 0.020”) in the fired case (formed from 348 Win). Another potential issue is shown by the case on the right. Wrinkles are hard to avoid when forming the 348 Win to 8 mm Krop and when it is fireformed, these wrinkles will typically crack and the case is not useable. The correct level of annealing is needed to avoid a high loss rate.
(left to right) Unfired case, fired case showing primer backing out, dents in the case shoulder
When all of these issues are added up, 348 Win cases are not the most efficient option. The alternative which eliminates all this drama is to use already formed Bertram brass and concentrate on shooting this historic rifle.
The one aspect of this cartridge which can cause issues is the groove diameter of the rifle. Depending on the reference, it ranges from 0.318” to 0.329”, with a standard 8 mm bullet being 0.323”. Two rifles I measured had diameters of 0.326” – a bit over-sized for off the shelf jacketed 8 mm bullets. Yet, shooting showed reasonable accuracy with standard jacketed 8mm bullets.
Lee makes an over-sized 8 mm mould (C329-205-1R) that is perfect for rifles with bores on the large side. It is meant for the 8 x 56R Austrian round with its 0.330” barrel. Since it is set up for gas-checks, leading will not be a problem. It does not hurt to try a standard 8mm cast bullet but the C329-205-1R may give better results. The other cast bullet used in the testing was a 0.326” gas-check, spitzer from a Lyman 323481, which with gas-check and lube runs around 195 gr. This was just marginally undersized for the rifle.
In the test rifle, the Lee bullet was slightly tight to chamber but it gave no indications of higher pressures. The Lyman bullet seated easily in the case and chambered smoothly.
It is worth noting that the Lyman bullet is a spitzer and while the recoil of the rifle is quite modest it would be prudent to single load it. The round-nose Lee bullet fed reliably from the magazine or can be single loaded as well.
This cartridge was pretty standard for the period looking at the case and the ballistics. The original loading was a compressed blackpowder charge that provided fairly modest velocities, even considering the bullet weight.
* compressed BP load
Designing a load for this rifle needs to take into account the action strength and age of the rifle. If you match the energy output of the original loading, the odds are good that you are in a safe area. Since the bullet weights we tried were well below the 248 gr factory load, the velocity limit we used was 1900 fps.
Trying to get to original velocities with blackpowder, is not possible even with compression, since cases are more heavily constructed in the web area and the walls. Coupled with modern blackpowder not being as energetic as was powder from back in the day, velocities were quite sedate. A full, settled, but only slightly compressed load of blackpowder weighed 59 grains and the velocity obtained reflects that. Even with settling and compression, the maximum of amount of BP was 63 gr, which is a long way from the 75 gr listed as a factory load.
The loads in the previous table are mild and that was intentional in deference to the age of the rifle. While blackpowder is a safe option, it is not recommended unless you want to spend more time cleaning the rifle and brass. If you want smoke, Triple 7 is a great choice. Lacking sulphur it is less corrosive to both brass and steel. An added benefit is that it is readily available – something that cannot be said for blackpowder and many nitrocellulose powders. Triple 7 provides velocities close to the original factory level at a safe pressure level and duplicates the blackpowder experience.
A full case of Trail Boss (to the base of the seated bullet) is 21 gr and as expected it produced mild velocities topping out around 1400 fps. Clean burning and allowing for the use of normal cleaning solvents makes this a favorite. We are now (Aug/2026) seeing it for sale in the USA again and with any luck it will show up here in the near future.
A5744, is a star powder for any blackpowder cartridge where you do not want the mess of inorganic propellants (BP, Pyrodex, Triple 7, etc.) but you want tuneable power loads – going from very mild to factory ballistics. Unlike most smokeless powders, A5744 burns clean even at very low pressures, making it ideal for reduced loads. When the powder first came out, the manufacturer’s recommendation was to fill the case to the base of the bullet and then take 40% of that as a safe starting load for a rifle suitable for smokeless powder. The maximum load is one that matches factory ballistics.
Shooting for accuracy with iron sights is best done by young eyes. That being said, as the next table shows, the Krop does well with jacketed and cast bullets.
The one addition to the above table that was not mentioned before is IMR 4320. This load came from Handloader #214 (Dec/Jan 2002). This Handloader article list loads for SR-4759 (no longer available) as well as for IMR 3031, 4895, 4064, 4350 and H4831 for jacketed bullets near the upper end of the velocity range.
In the Handloader article, 36 gr of IMR 4320 load gave 1892 fps, with a 200 gr jacketed bullet. We obtained 1750 fps with a 196 gr, 0.323” bullet. This might reflect barrel tolerances, case capacity or the powder itself. A problem with medium/slow burning rate powders is that at low load densities, fouling due to poor combustion can be a problem. With IMR 4320, the load density was 53% which was marginal and there was noticeably more carbon fouling in the barrel.
The Handloader article suggested up to 40 gr of IMR 4320 with a 200 gr bullet, yielding over 2000 fps. This would give 1780 ft/lbs of energy which is marginally above what factory loads would provide.
The groups were shot at 50 yards using a Leadsled and accuracy was quite respectable. Without the vertical stringing, which was likely shooter related, most groups were under 2”. A chronic problem older blackpowder rifles is that they shoot 6 – 12” high (or more) at 50 yards. A number of the loads shot close to the point of aim.
Between the two cast bullets, a slight accuracy edge went to the 195 gr spitzer and whether this was related to diameter or bullet design is hard to say. However, with both A5744 and IMR 4320 accuracy was good and younger eyes might be able to improve the group size. The advantage of the larger diameter Lee bullet is that it shot closer to the point of aim. While it was not tested, it is possible that increasing the velocity of the Lyman bullet to the same as for the Lee bullet may bring the point of impact down.
A5744 with the jacketed bullet consistently shot groups under 2”. The 205gr (0.331”) cast bullet when paired with IMR4320 grouped close to the point of aim
In summary, bringing the 8x60R back to life is a fairly easy task, with the most difficult item to find being the reloading dies. However, CH Tool and Die normally have them in stock. With the dies in hand, whether you decide to form cases from 348 Win brass or use already formed cases is a personal choice.
Loaded with cast bullets, the 8mm Krop is an accurate, mild shooting option. While standard 8mm bullets are an option, cast bullets provide good accuracy, are lower cost and will not wear the barrel.
Reloading Resources
Dies
CH Tool and Die (https://chtoolanddie.com/)
Brass
Beaks and Brass can supply 8 x 60R Kropatschek cases
Bullets
Higginson Powders (https://www.higginsonpowders.com) carries 0.323” Hornady bullets
And Lee 8x56R 0.329” 8mm bullet mould (C329-205-1R)
Reloading Reference
Handloader #214 Dec/Jan 2002
Disclaimer
All loads mentioned in this article were safe in the author’s rifle. However, since it is impossible to know the condition of other rifles and loading techniques, no warranty of suitability is implied or expressed and use of this data is solely at the risk of the user. In addition, any loads reported in the Handloader article, herein referenced, are not endorsed as safe by anyone other than Handloader magazine.